ozarque ([info]ozarque) wrote,
@ 2005-12-23 14:23:00
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Hobbitry; living underground, part 2
Mistakes

As I told you in an earlier post, when we built our underground house back in 1980 we made some mistakes. Not for lack of care, but for lack of adequate information about the process.

The worst mistake was failing to make the house big enough. We were trying for maximum efficiency and a simpler lifestyle, and trying to make our funds stretch as far as possible, and we achieved those goals. But we built a house for an image of our future based on two adults growing old together. We had no idea that several of our children -- and their children -- were going to move to Arkansas and join us, so that there was a serious need for a "rec room" of some kind where the kids could hang out, and for a guest wing where people could stay while finding jobs and places to live. We had no idea that we were going to start a small business and run it out of our house, so that there would be a serious need for places to put copiers and computers and printers and scanners and cameras and large quantities of stock -- books and tapes and videos and CDs and limited edition prints, and more. We had no idea that the house was also going to have to hold a small-press operation and a recording studio and a nursery (the plants kind of nursery) and an art studio. We built way too small. And with an underground house built in solid rock there is one fact that has to be faced: You can't just add on another room.

The second mistake was putting a flat roof on the place. It seemed like an excellent idea at the time. It gave us a big open area of concrete that was the perfect place to do container gardening, and the perfect place for kids to rollerskate ... things like that. George built a big screened porch in the middle of the roof, and we put porch rockers and a hammock inside; instant luxurious leisure, with no ticks and no bees or wasps, and fresh-air-and-view in all directions. You could landscape the earth all around the roof, with shrubs and flowers and ornamental trees. You could sit up there and talk, with suitable food and drink and company. It was wonderful.

Except for something we'd never thought of. The house sat in the middle of an open area that had been pastureland for cattle, and that porch was the tallest thing in the pasture. Every lightning bolt that came along headed straight for our place, and getting through the storms was an Experience. Every time there was a lightning storm we lost three or four light bulbs and at least one small appliance. Every two or three storms, the lightning fried one of our telephones. The special effects -- and the noise -- were absolutely spectacular. Trust me: You wouldn't have liked it one bit.

Another feature of the flat roof that we hadn't anticipated was that when the rain was heavy it came right on into the house and poured down the walls. We would stand by the walls with mops and buckets and big towels, trying to keep up; sometimes we managed to do that, and sometimes we didn't. George tried everything to seal the roof so that it wouldn't happen [insert long list of sealing compounds and doodads here], but nothing ever lasted through more than a couple of hard rains. Obviously, this wouldn't do.

Unlike the mistake of building too small, the flat-roof mistake was fixable. We had to give up that wonderful flat roof with all its benefits -- very reluctantly, I assure you -- and replace it with a peaked roof, and that solved the problem. Lightning strikes went from one per storm to one every ten years. The problem of water getting in and running down the walls went away. And it gave us an attic, which was useful. Progress was made, therefore.


[Now -- before you point out the obvious to me -- it is of course true that there was a way to solve the building-too-small problem and the flat-roof problem at the same time. If there'd been money enough available, we would have built a second story -- with a rec room and some office space -- and put the peaked roof on top of that. That was certainly obvious, but the money just wasn't there. Life is like that.]


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hi
[info]naturaloptions
2005-12-23 06:03 pm UTC (link)
You sound like a fascinating person! I am new at live journal and put in an interest search on Nutritional Therapy. Let me to one of your friends and then your entry which is so interesting! Lydia

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Re: hi
[info]ozarque
2005-12-24 01:48 pm UTC (link)
Thank you for your comment, and welcome to Live Journal.

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[info]jehannamama
2005-12-23 07:02 pm UTC (link)
This is facinating to be because I just love alternative home building.
I've helped three friends build their own houses, before I was to start on my planned rammed earth tire partially underground home. Regrettably, I became ill and never finished it.
I will say, though, that none of my friends is completely happy with their home when they think it's finished. They always have to alter some part of their design that they were sure was going to be just the most wonderful thing, because it ended up causing problems and just wasn't livable or practical. Building one's own home thus becomes a process that can span decades. I have friends who swear that the building never ends. Of course since then they've been busily putting up various barns, sheds, garages, machine shops, garden sheds, and a guest home, not to mention a heated, super insulated dog house.

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"buildings"
(Anonymous)
2005-12-24 03:42 am UTC (link)
My son saw the question somewhere "Why do they call them buildings? Why don't they call them builts?" and commented that obviously the person asking the question had never owned one. His experience is all with my houses, which, although they have been conventional older houses, I never can regard as finished. And then there's repairs . . .

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Alternative Home Building
(Anonymous)
2008-04-21 05:26 pm UTC (link)
I just wonder..sometime people use Simple shades (http://shedco.com.au/sheds/sheds.htm) and garages (http://shedco.com.au/sheds/garages.htm) as alternative home building. I know few of my friends staying that way. Amazing..right?

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[info]lily_durona
2005-12-23 07:35 pm UTC (link)
Actually, I was thinking of a lighting rod. Wouldn't the principle work the same?

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Lightning rods....
[info]ozarque
2005-12-24 01:25 pm UTC (link)
We looked into lightning rods very thoroughly, and everything we learned convinced us that that wouldn't have solved the problem.

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[info]archangelbeth
2005-12-23 08:05 pm UTC (link)
I'm bemused -- how did a peaked roof attract fewer lightning bolts than a flat one? Were they not the same height of "tallest thing in the pasture"?

My solution would probably have been a lightning rod and trees, and perhaps a peaked porch-roof. Still, the fundage might yet have been a problem, and I dunno if it could have sluiced out the water far enough not to get in your walls. Hrm.

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[info]ethesis
2005-12-24 12:55 am UTC (link)
Because it no longer had a porch, roof, etc. on top of it ...

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[info]wizwom
2006-10-31 03:15 pm UTC (link)
The peak lets the charge bleed off, esp. with a lightning rod, rather than build up.

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[info]neversremedy
2005-12-23 11:29 pm UTC (link)
Fascinating! Ah, what synchronicity, I was just writing about alternative housing a few minutes ago. ^__^

A lot of what you said was past tense, and I'm curious to know if you now have the money to work on adding to the house? Perhaps an on-going house project is too much stress over a long period of time, but adding trees and adding that second story to the house ... is it a matter of lack of funds, time, or energy? Or all three! By all means.

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[info]ozarque
2005-12-24 01:24 pm UTC (link)
I took care of the trees problem almost as soon as we moved into the house, but of course it took a while for them to grow. We've been here 26 years now, and the trees are big and beautiful (except of course for the sugar maple, which seems to grow half an inch a year, but even that one is thriving). However, adding the second story to the house is still out of the question. Especially at ages 69 and 70.

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[info]neversremedy
2005-12-24 07:42 pm UTC (link)
adding the second story to the house is still out of the question. Especially at ages 69 and 70.

I suppose it would be, although gods, you don't look it! (I attended a Laadan class you gave at Norwescon earlier this year.) It's a shame the kids didn't work on it with you earlier, but life gets in the way of projects all too often.

Be well.

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[info]momomom
2005-12-24 03:59 am UTC (link)
I was refered here by
[Error: Irreparable invalid markup ('<lj-user ="ab_xnfp">') in entry. Owner must fix manually. Raw contents below.]

I was refered here by <lj-user ="ab_xnfp"> and have LJ-friended you as a result. I hope that's OK. I was hooked by this entry alone. I am fascinated with underground houses but aspire only to building a rootcellar.

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Response to momomom....
[info]ozarque
2005-12-24 01:49 pm UTC (link)
It's certainly OK to have LJ-friended me. Absolutely. Thank you for your comment.

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[info]ethesis
2005-12-25 11:16 pm UTC (link)
It is a wonderful afternoon. We got up, had my six-year-old tell us that it was too early to get up (it was 7:00), so we went back to bed, then she *woke* up and we had a great morning, went to church, came back and everyone is sort of sitting around being happy.

So I thought I'd read a little for relaxation as instead of buying me books, I was swamped with gift cards for books ;)

Just dropped by to wish you and yours a Merry Christmas.

Steve

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[info]wizwom
2005-12-26 04:28 am UTC (link)
Cool story.

Let's see...
1) Lightning Rod. I know, odd concept, but it works.
2) If you are going to have a physical constraint, such as earth, outside a wall, the wall must be well sealed. And allowance must be made for run-off. The simplest solution is a gravel fill for the first foot outside the concrete wall, and plenty of sumping ability.
3) most "flat" roofs have a grade, a drain system, and a small edge lip - so that run-off is collected easily and does not run down the walls.

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Time travel....
[info]ozarque
2005-12-26 03:25 pm UTC (link)
Suppose it's 1980/1981, and you're at our place discussing the underground house mistakes with my husband. Since you know that you're right, and he knows that he's right, the two of you will able to while away a pleasant afternoon or two arguing.

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Re: Time travel....
[info]wizwom
2005-12-26 03:27 pm UTC (link)
LOL
heh, I hadn't read the other comments before saying that. Why won't a lightning Rod work to protect a flat roof in a meadow?

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Re: Time travel....
[info]ozarque
2005-12-26 03:49 pm UTC (link)
I have no idea. I only know that George -- who built this house and did all the wiring and plumbing and propane-ing and paneling and insulating and air-conditioner-installing and so on by himself -- told me that it wouldn't work. I've had decades of evidence that when it comes to building things and fixing things he knows what he's talking about -- often he builds and fixes things that I've heard alleged experts tell him to his face cannot be built or cannot be fixed. I therefore do not argue with him in that context. He doesn't argue with me about prepositions, and I don't argue with him about lightning rods.

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Re: Time travel....
[info]ethesis
2005-12-27 04:24 pm UTC (link)
It depends what kind of lightning you are getting (is it going up from the gound or down from the sky) and whether your goal is to divert the flow of the lightning to ground or otherwise.

Suffice it to say, if you are in the ground, a lightning rod (which diverts to ground) is problematic ;)

With lightning going the other way (where the points lead to discharges that are more gradual), the surge issues are different.

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